in The Farm (Moderator: farmguy)

Me thinks we need trolls on our forums more often. I have gotten this much entertainment on here in quite some time
Keep it coming and I will use more emoticons

:)As promised!  :-* :-*
  8) 8)

 :-* :-*

It seems like every few years someone comes on our forum and whines and rants about how we are a bunch of elitist snobs because we have a private trail,yada, yada, yada. Funny thing is, I don't think I ever told anybody that asked that they couldn't come and ride at the farm.

...
  2) A little concerned that anyone can stay entertained with so few ride spots and so little room for creativity...mountain biking is supposed to be a laid back sport for those of us who aren't interested in following the rules. Trails need not be built with permits or regulations in mind, just fun and adventure
  ...

Even though your post is 99% trolling, I think this point is worth an attempt at a serious discussion:

 "mountain biking is...a sport for those of us who aren't interested in following the rules. Trails need not be built with permits or regulations in mind..."

The assumptions underlying this statement are breathtaking to say the least. To my knowledge, there isn't a scrap of land anywhere that isn't owned by someone. I'll grant you that it's more likely that unsanctioned trails can be built in some western states without having them immediately shut down. But it's short sighted to imply that this is going to work out well in the end. Here's a relevant thread from MTBR:

http://forums.mtbr.com/trail-building-advocacy/imbas-new-chapter-program-655071-3.html

If you skip down to about entry #73 the fun with the Sedona Arizona IMBA chapter begins. For those of you who don't want to wade through it, the skinny that a lot of the fine trails in that area were built without permission from the government agency administering the land. Some of it has been grandfathered in, some has not. The situation has degenerated into what could be charitably described as a pissing match between the original builders, the regional IMBA representative, the land manager and various other parties. Nobody is happy and some of the trails people sweat blood to build are being shut down.

In the real western USA as everywhere, land use permissions have to be worked out under the law or at some point there is hell to pay. In the fantasy west of your imagination this doesn't apply I guess. Good luck with your move.

Walt

haha Boy you just opened a can you shouldn't have and you know what... Yeah you just got unloaded on and I rest assured its not the last LOL. Sure I was like I have to pay to bike wow so much for free workouts and cheap fun but you know what 16$ is not a lot to spend for Everything you get riding the trails at QR , Cam rock, and the others I haven't been to Yet. I will become a member when my finances can afford it and help on the trails when time permits me. I see your point on The Farm but you know what!!! Its private land who Freaking cares man its his right to have it that way, if it was my land it would be the same. And yeah I would love to be asked to come take a look and ride it sure but my time will come I don't mind waiting. I payout for all my hunting licenses fishing ski trail passes and memberships involved. So I think the meisly amount of money is not a big deal for having a blast outdoors hanging out with people that enjoy the same things as me. Wisconsin has plenty to offer if you do not like it Please leave the state as your taking up space and breathing our fresh air.

In short these fellow bike lovers do plenty for the amount payd and it is not expected that you pay to join but pay to ride. So go back to your wonder west and rag on them for all they do then shut up. :-X :'( layoff buddy

 

One of my favorites:

"A waste of perfectly good oxygen."

Does Blackhawk cost $50? A county pass doesn't.  I rode BH once with Tim S and decided I didn't want to pay for it so I never bought a pass. I could see being upset if you paid first then rode it and didn't like it.

Or maybe he bout the state trail pass (like for military ridge) and thought that was required for the MTB trails?

Or maybe he bout the state trail pass (like for military ridge) and thought that was required for the MTB trails?

The state trail pass is required for the MTB trails that are on state land...including Blue Mound State Park and Kettle Moraine State Forest as well as the Military Ridge, Glacial Drumlin, Badger State, Capitol City Trail, 400 Trail, Elroy-Sparta Trail...you actually get a lot of trail around the state for that trail pass along with XC skiing. 

That state trail pass was required for trail on state lands long before CORP was around and will be required long after CORP has disappeared.  Meaning, CORP has nothing to do with determining fees on state land.  That goes for Dane County land (Cam-Rock) as well.

Or maybe he bout the state trail pass (like for military ridge) and thought that was required for the MTB trails?

The state trail pass is required for the MTB trails that are on state land...including Blue Mound State Park and Kettle Moraine State Forest as well as the Military Ridge, Glacial Drumlin, Badger State, Capitol City Trail, 400 Trail, Elroy-Sparta Trail...you actually get a lot of trail around the state for that trail pass along with XC skiing. 

That state trail pass was required for trail on state lands long before CORP was around and will be required long after CORP has disappeared.  Meaning, CORP has nothing to do with determining fees on state land.  That goes for Dane County land (Cam-Rock) as well.

IIRC the State Trail pass is $20.
The Dane County Parks pass is $16. If CORP would not have fought against it they would have raised the DCP pass to $25 two years ago.
And again, we do not set these rates, they are set by their governing boards. As they also set rates for disk golfers, dog park users, XC skiers, etc...

Man alive are people stupid as to the differences between state and local regulations for recreational opportunities.

WI is a pay for use state but actually has some of the lowest park permit/trail pass fees. yes there are some states where everything is free. Hey it would be great to live there but we don't. We live in WI and we have to deal with the stuff here. Shocking.

FYI a CO state vehicle sticker is $70.00. Ours is $25.00 by golly is that a western state which has a higher fee than WI? Now they don't have a individual trail pass for MTBing but if you figure ours is only $20.00 and it covers skiing, rail trails, horseback riding and basically anything involving a WI state trail you're only paying a max of $45.00. Still less than CO.  again WI makes you pay for stuff you use. Oh and considering that Dane county last year sold 536 MTB passes last year I highly doubt everyone is buying a pass.

In case you're slow here are the fees:
Blue Mound/Kettle Moraine - state park fees $4/day $20/year
Quarry Ridge Rec Area - free
Middleton bike park - free
CamRock/Badger Prairie - $16/year

Don't like the fees? Petition your representatives or just bitch on a website. I'm sure that will work too.

Does Blackhawk cost $50? A county pass doesn't.  I rode BH once with Tim S and decided I didn't want to pay for it so I never bought a pass. I could see being upset if you paid first then rode it and didn't like it.

Or maybe he bout the state trail pass (like for military ridge) and thought that was required for the MTB trails?

Blackhawk has gone from $10 - $35, and the season has gone from Memorial Day - Labor Day to from when skiing stops until skiing starts.

If you rode it when Tim S was in town you didn't ride it since the upper flow trail was made suitable for kids (and others) learning or the new trail that is on downhill ski slope. It's still a small place but offers a sort of fun and freedom no other spot has around here.

Blackhawk membership does something very important for the sport and outdoor life style. Blackhawk is one of the area youth MTB programs, has outreach programs for disabled athletes and vets, and has sent a number of athletes to the Olympics. Add Blackhawk is an IMBA affiliate club so the check Blackhawk writes to IMBA helps  CORP and the regional IMBA rep get things done. The Blackhawk board recently approved up to $5000/year for 3 years to seed youth mountain biking and improve facilities so membership is a good investment in the sport even if you don't even ride there.

Blackhawk does other elitist things that will grind at any trail anarchist and spend money. Blackhawk joins all sorts of groups that promote outdoor sports and makes sure people are representing outdoor life style interests when resources are at risk. Add having parties where law requires the beer be free. Just to get even more people bent out of shape, we have and event that combine mountain bikes and guns.

Also some information about where your trail pass money goes to:

http://dnr.wi.gov/topic/parks/trailpass.html#money

Last year, the state collected a total of about $1.26 million in state trail pass fees (previous recent years have ranged from $1.01 to $1.30 million in revenues). The revenue generated by the state trail pass does not cover expenses for the trails for which it is charged. For example, the average revenue for state-operated state trails was $29,171 in 2008. For the same time, average expenses for each trail were $84,341. The difference in the amount required to operate a state trail and the money received from the sale of state trail passes is covered by monies from the separate Wisconsin State Park System account which includes funds from state park admission stickers, camping fees and some state tax dollars.

Man alive are people stupid as to the differences between state and local regulations for recreational opportunities.

WI is a pay for use state but actually has some of the lowest park permit/trail pass fees. yes there are some states where everything is free. Hey it would be great to live there but we don't. We live in WI and we have to deal with the stuff here. Shocking.

FYI a CO state vehicle sticker is $70.00. Ours is $25.00 by golly is that a western state which has a higher fee than WI? Now they don't have a individual trail pass for MTBing but if you figure ours is only $20.00 and it covers skiing, rail trails, horseback riding and basically anything involving a WI state trail you're only paying a max of $45.00. Still less than CO.  again WI makes you pay for stuff you use. Oh and considering that Dane county last year sold 536 MTB passes last year I highly doubt everyone is buying a pass.

In case you're slow here are the fees:
Blue Mound/Kettle Moraine - state park fees $4/day $20/year
Quarry Ridge Rec Area - free
Middleton bike park - free
CamRock/Badger Prairie - $16/year

Don't like the fees? Petition your representatives or just bitch on a website. I'm sure that will work too.

Shhh... sometimes there are not many people at public hearings while so many others are wasting bandwidth and disk space instead.